WWII Outfits and Gear

maj_barnes · Post by **maj_barnes** » Thu Jun 23, 2005 3:51 pm

One like it.

It's just a good deal since I'm seeing JUST the bag on some sites for $80.

Epsilon · Post by **Epsilon** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 4:46 am

It's a good deal. Period.

Screw the fake shitty "look-alike" M43 jackets. It you look long enough you can find really nice originals cheap. Pre ww2, everyone was issued the first pattern M41 Parson's jackets. Since 1941, the second, most common M41 came out and was used until the end of the war. The M43 came out and was issued in quantity in 1944. By the end of the year, almost everyone had them.

Leggings came in all sorts of sizes and colors. The most common is khaki, but I own some darker OD variations. Probably produced late in the war.

The 1936 musette bag was desgined as a replacement for the 1928 haversack in the Army. The haversack was used until the end of the war; most infantry weren't issued them. The paratroopers had them as standard issue. Often, officers got them for their own field usage, but for many it was not acceptable. Few troops bought them as private purchases for their own personal uses. In 1945, the musette bag was yet again replaced by the M45 field and cargo pack, which was made standard for the war in Korea.

Which pouch was more commonly used??? LOL They were all commonly used! It just depends what weapon you have! Those pouches were designed for the Thompson submachine gun. They came in singles, triples, pentuples, all different numbers. Only the officers and NCOs were issued a Thompson submachine gun. Period. A lot of troops got General Purpose bags, which could hold half a dozen Thompson clips, easy.

Epsilon · Post by **Epsilon** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 4:48 am

tallman_house_pictures · Fri Jun 24, 2005 6:48 am

http://matt.echowave.net/reenact/05june/022.jpg
What kind of weapon does the guy on the left have slinged???

lol...a 7 pocket 30 rnd thompson mag carrier...thats the first (riggers model i presume) i've seen

Epsilon · Post by **Epsilon** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 6:53 am

That's Cliff. (refer to photo 017) He's our squad leader and he's got a Thompson!

If you look second to the right, he's got a .30 cal light machine gun!

Gyro · Post by **Gyro** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 7:06 am

http://matt.echowave.net/reenact/05june/005.jpg
INACCURATE JEEP CAP!!! ABANDON THE ENTIRE PROJECT AND GROUP!!

Epsilon · Post by **Epsilon** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 7:12 am

Actually, it looks like one of those more rare non-issued caps produced and donated during WW2 by the Christian Science War Relief Committee, similar to the M1941 wool knit cap. Very interesting...

maj_barnes · Post by **maj_barnes** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 12:41 pm

http://matt.echowave.net/reenact/05june/020.jpg

The guy toward the rear looks like his pack was going to fall off.

justin!butcher · Post by **justin!butcher** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 2:45 pm

Nice pictures!

Epsilon · Post by **Epsilon** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 7:33 pm

maj_barnes wrote:The guy toward the rear looks like his pack was going to fall off.

lol Yeah, Ben was carrying probably around 100 pounds of stuff. He filled his haversack with blankets and food and as many burlap sacks as he could stick on. He's got his rifle, full load of ammo, the .30 cal tripod, full cans of ammo for the .30 cal, shovel, and the canteens. It's a lot of weight! Plus we were marching uphill. It's a good thing that morning was overcast; if it had been as hot as it got later that day, we'd have died!

Dispite our Allied advantage in numbers and in height, the Germans managed to take most of our hill... it was crazy, even their medics had grenades!!!

evan · Post by **evan** » Sat Jun 25, 2005 4:17 am

how do you use grenades in a reenactment?

Epsilon · Post by **Epsilon** » Sat Jun 25, 2005 10:08 am

Rubber replicas! You don't use cast iron because they hurt! Often there is a streamer that comes out the bottom, so you can find it later and easier to see and let your enemies know they are dead!

Gyro · Post by **Gyro** » Sat Jun 25, 2005 5:44 pm

Some streamers are long enough to simulate the radius of the blast, so if you get one thrown at you and you're within that radius, yeah, you're dead. Speaking of reenacting, I'm most likely by the end of the summer, helping a bunch of guys to start up an official group, most likely an 82nd impression.

tallman_house_pictures · Sun Jun 26, 2005 5:42 am

Wheres ur new wwii flick epsilon?

Epsilon · Post by **Epsilon** » Sun Jun 26, 2005 8:22 am

One, it's not my movie. Two, I don't have a clue when he'll get me a copy. You don't have to keep asking me. When it's up, you will know it.

As for grenade streamers... maybe with German grenades you MIGHT be able to stuff a streamer that long into. The kill radius for reenacting purposes is 5 yards! As long as it is seen, that's good enough!

Gyro,

If you want my dear opinion, I think you should start with infantry at events. The paratroopers should be after you have more experience with the basics of field infantry. The biggest reason for that is: you need to have all the infantry items anyways, and it's best to get all the basic and intermediate impression down first. THEN when you have infantry down, you should move onto the Paratroopers.

Another very good reason is because Paratrooper items are EXPENSIVE!!! Don't bit off more than you can chew. You will Need to have your basic infantry outfit down (that's a given), and many groups even expect you to bring a parachute harness, and reserve chute!

There are dozens of things that are added onto the impression as well. These are amongst a couple thing other reenactors have pointed out to me.

Please do not start your group up on your own, just for the sake of it; be sure to have reenactors with experience help you to get started. You should study a lot of the area and period knowledge of the division, with whom they worked, where in history, why it was, etc. You should have a reason for choosing a certain division. Everyone should have at least the basic of basics: wools, boots, and a helmet of some sort. Don't start up half-arsed if you know what I mean. Keep it as authentic as you possibly can. Starting up a group just for the gung-ho game playing gunslinger, Paratroops like Band of Brothers, and yet can't bother to get the right boots... is just terrible and is a kick in the butt towards history.

I'm not trying to demean you knowledge of the subject or keep you from doing what you think is right. I don't even know who you are starting it up with! But just as one reenactor to another, I just wanted to throw my few cents in and say: let's keep the hobby original and as authentic as possible! Let's recreate history, Not the movies!

maj_barnes · Post by **maj_barnes** » Sun Jun 26, 2005 10:03 pm

I got a kevlar helmet for my birthday, and I was thinking of making to look like a German helmet. The only way I can think of to look like this is to get the German helmet cover. Do any of you think this would make it look LIKE a German helmet?

Epsilon · Post by **Epsilon** » Mon Jun 27, 2005 12:28 am

You know what... I tried that a couple times and never could really pull it off. Eventually I made my own replicas using vacuform plastic shells and reproduction parts.

http://matt.echowave.net/images/helmets2.jpg

One of the concepts that was put into the design of the kevlar helmet was the German helmet, therefore the small similarity. But as I tried, it never really worked as there are too many differences to be convincing. For one, the modern helmets are layers of fiberglass and fabrics glued together, then spackled. Helmets of WW2 are stamped steel and more linear. That made production faster and cheaper.

If you want to get a reproduction German helmet cover and try it anyways, www.atthefront.com has among the best repro stuff I know of. In fact, that's where I got the repro stuff for my homemade helmets.

I'm holding both helmet types right here, and my guess is a cover won't fit well at all; the kevlar helmets are larger. Besides all that, the chinstraps are not remotely similar!

You can find some quite decent reproduction German helmets on eBay for $80.

maj_barnes · Post by **maj_barnes** » Mon Jun 27, 2005 1:01 am

I found an ad in shotgun news for a repo German helmet with decal for $44.

That magazine has so much great stuff:
bandoliers-99 cents
m1 ammo belt-$20
k98 leather ammo pouches-$30 for a pair
making a LOW budget WW2 movie-priceless.
There are somethings that you can't buy, for everything else, there's your parents.

Edit-
What's vacumfoam?

Epsilon · Post by **Epsilon** » Mon Jun 27, 2005 1:22 am

Vacuform process is a method of molding plastics.

Read this: http://www.clubhyper.com/reference/vacformbg_1.htm

maj_barnes · Post by **maj_barnes** » Mon Jun 27, 2005 1:49 am

Okay, so what you used for the helmets would be thicker than what would be used for the model they were doing, or is it the same thickness?

tallman_house_pictures · Mon Jun 27, 2005 4:27 am

After WWII she spanich used captured german machinery to make their own helmets. A guy near me has these for sale. The shell is pretty much identical to an m42 but the chinstraps and liners are different.

www.militarytour.com ... they are $40. Also, ima ( www.uma-usa.com ) has the spanish ones for $40 (in better shape), and scratch and dent ones for $12.50 (they arent on the site anymore but I found them in the catalouge. If you'd bve interested just call or email about it; im sure they have some left.)

Direct military tour link : http://www.militarytour.com/Militaria/W ... Helmet.htm

Direct IMA link : http://www.ima-usa.com/product_info.php ... cts_id/385

They are the same.

UFProductions · Post by **UFProductions** » Mon Jun 27, 2005 4:31 am

You should make and sell those Vacuforms Epsilon. Priced right I know I'd be interested.

Gyro · Post by **Gyro** » Mon Jun 27, 2005 6:57 am

Epsilon, I know. I'm not starting the group on my own. There are already 3 guys with full 82nd impressions that have been doing it for years, they're just trying to find local guys to join up so they can start a much closer group. Thanks for the advice though.

Epsilon · Post by **Epsilon** » Mon Jun 27, 2005 9:59 am

Awsome! Look forward to hearing some of your stories!

Those wonderful plastic German helmets I made cost me about $50 each! If you want a couple, I can make you some for the same price, but it might take me a while as I'd have to buy everything needed and spend the time putting it all together. I like them better than the real ones in some ways... perfect for stunts because they'll bend a bit if you hit your noggin! They aren't any thicker than the steel ones. As for size, I always thought they ran a little small, but I measured and are identical. Pretty good!

Spanish and Czech Helmets... okay I read a bunch on them. At first I thought they were identical as well! But there are several differences. There were three common helmet patterns in WW2: the M35, M40, and M42. Each version designed to make production faster and cheaper than the previous. The Spaniard stamps were very similar and mainly based off the M42 design (which were mainly used mid-late WW2 in Germany) but they added a couple things.

The most obvious difference is the little badge holder thingie welded on the front. These can be grinded off with a little skill in the workshop. The next thing I noticed were the extra liner rivets in the frontal area, the liners are differently made, and if you look instead you can see why. German chinstraps were leather (and I think still are today) rather than fabric. The OD colors are a little different as well, not that anyone would notice, but you should probably paint it anyway if you decide to grind it.

$40 and a little work, you could have a pretty decent German helmet. As for me, as much as I would normally like to get original items, our movie props in war films tend to get totally molested and annihilated... So I buy the reproductions!

maj_barnes · Post by **maj_barnes** » Fri Jul 22, 2005 8:28 pm

Since no ones made a post in forever and a day, I thought I'd give you guys a link to some cheap 1928 haversacks (including meat can pouch). They're 35 dollars on ebay and come with two first aid pouches.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... =WDVW&rd=1